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tline3open  Monogram or Maker's Mark?

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Author Topic:   Monogram or Maker's Mark?
Paul Lemieux

Posts: 1792
Registered: Apr 2000

iconnumber posted 02-05-2007 12:18 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Paul Lemieux     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I picked up this old 19C spoon, which I think is Austro-Hungarian or German, because I thought the monogram on the front was interesting. I think it reads "TT". The monogram was die-struck, not engraved. I have seen a few continental spoons with maker or other marks stamped on the front, but this "TT" seems too large for a maker's mark (it measures 1/2" x 3/8"). However, a custom die-struck monogram seems highly unlikely, especially on an otherwise mediocre spoon like this. Is it just a big maker's mark? Does anybody have an opinion?


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blakstone

Posts: 493
Registered: Jul 2004

iconnumber posted 02-05-2007 11:35 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for blakstone     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
No, it is definitely an applied monogram, not at all uncommon in the mid-19th century.

The spoon was made in Berlin between 1850 and 1854. It bears marks of two assayers in accordance with the Berlin guild regulations from 1819. The first has the city mark - a rampant bear - with the letter K, the mark of assayer JCS Kessner, in office 1819-1854. The secondary assayer's mark is the letter C, that of JWD Friedrich, in office 1848-1854. The maker's mark is FRIEDEBERG for Heinrich Friedeberg, master 1850. The master date of 1850 gives the lower limit and the final year of both assayers in 1854 gives the upper limit: thus 1850-1854. Your spoon is probably 12 lot (.750) silver, the Berlin minimum fineness; pieces of higher quality has to be so marked.

Hope this helps!

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Paul Lemieux

Posts: 1792
Registered: Apr 2000

iconnumber posted 02-05-2007 12:00 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Paul Lemieux     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi blakstone, thanks for the information. I am amazed that they would have gone through the trouble of cutting a die for the monogram (it is die-struck, not applied). It just seems like more expense and hassle than it is worth for such a common looking article.

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tmockait

Posts: 963
Registered: Jul 2004

iconnumber posted 02-05-2007 03:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for tmockait     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Paul,

Since you seem to collect a lot of German silver, you might find this link useful. It gives the the alphabet in classical German script known as "Scrhrift" in use until the middle of the 19th century (and revived by the Nazis). I think the letters on the spoon may be "F" rather than "T".
[IMG gone from the internet - h-roesler.de/_text/kopf.gif]

Translation: Welcome to the site of the German Schrift Foundation.

You don't need to read German to benefit from the alphabet list.

Hope this helps,
Tom.]

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Paul Lemieux

Posts: 1792
Registered: Apr 2000

iconnumber posted 02-05-2007 05:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Paul Lemieux     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Tom, thanks for that link. Very helpful. I never really got into silver from the continent before, but I have found some fun and fascinating pieces lately so I'm accumulating a small group of continental curiosities. This particular spoon obviously isn't rare or valuable, but it's well made and hefty so I guess I'll just start using it for cereal or soup.

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tmockait

Posts: 963
Registered: Jul 2004

iconnumber posted 02-05-2007 05:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for tmockait     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Paul,

Actually, it was made in the last decade or so before German unification, and has a rather interesting and complete set of marks. The monograph suggests it was part of a set that has been broken up. Who knows how many of these items are left in the world? I was at an antiques market in Garmisch-Partenkirchen, Bavaria last year. Spoons like that were going for 25 or more Euros apiece. You might want to wait before relegating it to Rice Krispies duty!

All the best,
Tom

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