posted 04-26-2005 07:43 AM            

Regimental dress was unique to each unit. The National Army Museum in London has a large collection of period uniforms and memorabilia. Check their web page. Also, try the Imperial War Museum. British regiments, even those who have been disbanded, also have museums and "old boys clubs." The National museums can tell you which town held the Northumberland regimental depot (HQ), and you can write to them or visit. Contacting them may help you with the id; the museums might also be willing to help.

Do post the picture for us though!

Tom

posted 04-26-2005 08:40 AM            

Have tried to post a photo. It is not a medal as there is a safety pin attachment on the back. I have my grandfather's medals with ribbons from South Africa and Hazar, Afghanistan. I will try to photograph marks.
Roy

posted 04-26-2005 10:42 AM            

The date letter is hard to read in your photo, but it could be 1859 or 1909. I suspect the former, which is a capital letter. Although this would be a bit earlier than your grandfather's service, it might have been passed on to him.

Good luck,
Tom

posted 04-26-2005 10:53 AM            

Thank you. I've been to the Northumberland Fusiliers Museum at Alnwick Castle, Northumberland and like you thought that this badge/pin had more Naval/Marine than Army connotations. One of my father's brothers was a Marine.

I expect that if I can find out when S & W Ld were manufacturing it may give a better clue to the date. Maybe someone else using the forum may be able to assist in that area?

Thanks again
Roy

posted 04-26-2005 02:22 PM            

The Royal Navy Gunnery School , and
The Royal Marines Artillery

posted 04-26-2005 06:26 PM            

I don't think so as the hallmarks are definitely British as is the background of the original owner. This is probably an item for a dress uniform, since most uniform insignia would be of baser, cheaper metal.

I with agree with the naval insignia idea, although the absence of any slogan or inscription is puzzling. I am still betting it is a cap badge.

posted 04-27-2005 08:42 AM            

You are so right. I double checked and realized I was consulting a chart that ended with the 1920s! This new info pretty much confirms that badge could not have been part of the Fusiliers turn of the century kit. Yes, this one is driving me crazy as well.

posted 04-27-2005 03:48 PM            

You may well be right, certainly it doesn't appear to fit with the career of the original owner, and undoubtedly it was made in England.

However at this point all I can say is that the design is EQUAL to the centre of the Grand Army of the Frontier medal as pictured on their web site. And described in words as follows: "The central Seal has the words GRAND ARMY OF THE FRONTIER surrounding a cannon behind an anchor behind a crossed rifle and sword".

Either it's an incredible coincidence, or the society dates back to the 1930s, or they have reused an existing army badge.

I've sent off an e-mail to the society, so if they get back to me I will certainly post their answer.

posted 04-27-2005 04:15 PM            

I suspect the latter since this design may be a common motif. The absence of a slogan as on the badge you describe is the odd thing, so too is it being made of silver, which is not common for ordinary insignia. Anyway, I look forward to learning what reply you get. I will also try to check with the National Army Museum in London and see if they have any ideas. The challenging ones are fun to research!

posted 04-27-2005 04:16 PM            

"The GAF was founded 1 January 2003 to unite renactors and Cowboy Action Shooters who had an affinity for and an interest in the Victorian era
military of any nation. Looking at the badge, it could be some kind of military fraternal emblem. That design was around from the American Civil War and our membership badge is a copy of it. Sorry to disappoint you..."

posted 04-27-2005 08:34 PM            

Your instincts are still good. I think this is a common naval motif, and it is more likely that the American badge is the copy of an English one than the other way around. I have sent an e-mail to the National Army Museum in Chelsea and am optimistic we will solve this interesting puzzel.

posted 05-02-2005 02:53 PM            

The only new thought I can contribute at this time is that is could be a sweetheart pin. Sweetheart pins are typically done in sterling and sometimes gold. They were purchased at jewelry stores or army post exchanges by men in the military to give to their mothers, wives, girlfriends or daughters to wear. Some of the nicer ones were made by fancy jewelers, but the majority were made by the ordinary manufacturers of regular jewelry.

posted 05-03-2005 06:14 PM            

The 1934 date advised for the badge and the spoons ties in with his retirement year.

Just to throw another pebble in the pond I know that he was a Commissionaire i.e. Corps of Commissionaires - did they recruit from all branches of the services?

Roy

posted 05-05-2005 09:54 AM            

Tom

posted 05-14-2005 10:03 AM            

Despite much scouring of the Internet and medal dealers I still haven't seen another picture of one but my verbal description to some of these dealers has resulted in the Commissionaires response.

Not sure that this topic can go any further but thank you sincerely for all of your thoughts and help. They made interesting reading.