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 American Silver before sterling
 Another Ball, Black and Co. article
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| Author | Topic: Another Ball, Black and Co. article |
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ahwt Posts: 2334 |
posted 09-14-2006 08:49 PM
  
  Here is another Ball, Black and Co. article marked with 950/1000 only this time the extra marks are G & B. I can not find any reference to a G & B and wonder if any one else knows. Soeffing's section in Venable's book "Silver in America" states that Ball, Black and Co. was in business from 1851 to 1874. William Gale was one of their suppliers, but Gale never, to my knowledge, had a partner with their last name starting with the letter B. Another supplier named by Soeffing was Nicholas Bogert; however I think that the section on William Bogert indicates that it was not Nicholas, but rather his son William that supplied silver to Ball, Black and Co. William Bogert had two associations with men whose last name started with the letter G; John Gordon in the mid 1850's and later Charles Grosjean (a producer for Tiffany). The association with Grosjean however was one of purchaser as Bogert apparently bought out Grosjean estate and was never really in business with him. That leaves John Gordon as the most likely candidate for the G in the G & B mark. Two things bother me about this conclusion. First, would Bogert have consented to listing his name second? Secondly, Gordon and Bogert has another partner by the name of Eaton, but initial his not in the mark. Any information about the G & B mark would be appreciated. When I bought the creamer its style was referred to as the lighthouse style. Is that a term anyone is familiar with? It is substantial in weight and the upper portion sets in a base whose width is a bit wider and this provides better stability. There is a dot in front of the G, however there is no indication of any letter in front of the dot. IP: Logged |
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swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 |
posted 09-15-2006 12:59 PM
"Lighthouse style" is a term commonly used to describe tall pewter flagons, coffepots, and other vessels that taper smoothly from a wider round base to a narrower top, thus resembling a lighthouse. I think it was an incorrect description of this piece, which does not taper. IP: Logged |
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Ulysses Dietz Moderator Posts: 1265 |
posted 09-15-2006 03:42 PM
I hope I do this right. Eaton, Gordon & Bogert, of Newburgh, NY, produced silver for Ball, Black & Co. This kettle, dated 1857, is part of a full tea and coffee service made for a couple named O'Gorman in Newark, NJ as wedding silver. I'm sure the G&B is the latter two of the three-name group. The Bogert is the heir of Nicholas Bogert, who worked in NYC in the 1820s and 30s. IP: Logged |
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Ulysses Dietz Moderator Posts: 1265 |
posted 09-15-2006 03:44 PM
And here is the mark on all of the pieces of this set. IP: Logged |
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wev Moderator Posts: 4121 |
posted 09-15-2006 07:25 PM
John Gordon began his apprenticeship with Nicholas Bogert and, after Bogert's death in 1843, finished it with Bogert's son, James. Gordon married James' daughter, Jane around 1848. The William Eaton/John Gordon/William Bogert (James' younger brother) partnership dated from 1856 to 1860; Gordon & Bogert dated from 1860 to 1864. I took the liberty of fiddling your image a bit IP: Logged |
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ahwt Posts: 2334 |
posted 09-17-2006 09:39 AM
Venable notes that the Ball, Black and Co was on the 950-1000 standard between 1858 and 1860. As WEV points out the Eaton, Gordon and Bogert partnership dated from 1856 to 1860 while the Gordon and Bogert partnership dated form 1860 to 1864. The mark on this creamer (.G & B) together with the 950-1000 mark could have been made under either partnership. It could be that whoever stamped the piece simply left off the E and the beginning of the mark, although if this was a one piece die that would seem hard to do. It could also be that Eaton was gone at the time this piece was made and his initial was intentional left off, but for some reason the period after his initial still remained. Perhaps they modified the die for E. G & B and did not eliminate the dot. It would be interesting to see if other pieces done under the Gordon and Bogert partnership had the same .G & B mark. Thanks Swarter for clearing up the lighthouse question as I never did understand that reference used with this item. Thanks Ulysses showing the beautiful piece from your coffee and tea service. It is very apparent that there was a lot of competition to be a supplier to Ball, Black and Co. IP: Logged |
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