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 SMP Silver Salon Forums
 Continental / International Silver
 Antique Ladle Mark Identification
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| Author | Topic: Antique Ladle Mark Identification |
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efuerst100 Posts: 34 |
posted 01-17-2009 06:18 PM
  
[26-1787] Hi- I usually collect old Italian coin silver flatware and holloware, as I love the patina and workmanship. I am not a dealer; I just buy and keep items for my own enjoyment (except that I admit that I don't particularly enjoy polishing and my kids think I have gone overboard on collecting). Recently, my parents gave me a very old coin silver ladle. The ladle is a massive 14 inches in length and its bowl holds 6 ounces of liquid. It was passed down from my father's side of the family, which hails from Austria. My parents think the ladle has been in the family for generations and therefore must be Austrian. However, there are no Diana heads or shield-like marks, which I associate with older Austrian silver. Instead, there are four marks which I am having trouble identifying. I'm leaning toward concluding that the piece is an older piece from Hamburg because one mark is a castle (albeit not necessarily with the customary 3 towers) and indicates that the silver content is 13 loths. I'm attaching 4 photos hoping that somebody more knowledgeable can confirm my identification or point me to a more accurate identification of the marks. I'm particularly interested in learning how old the piece is. IP: Logged |
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bascall Posts: 1629 |
posted 01-17-2009 11:03 PM
Could be Budapest too. There are some pretty knowledgeable people on this site when it comes to continental silver that will no doubt steer you right. IP: Logged |
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blakstone Posts: 493 |
posted 01-18-2009 12:23 AM
Yes, Budapest . . . or more accurately, Pest. The tower mark is that of the Hungarian city of Pest before it and the cities of Buda and Obuda were combined in 1873 to form the modern city of Budapest; the mark in this form dates from the late 18th/early 19th century. And yes, the 13 is for 13 lot (.813) silver. The “L” in the center is the assayer’s letter for 1792-1797, which dates your ladle. The maker “JP” is Jozsef Prandtner, Sr.: Master 4 Dec 1791, died 18 Dec 1819. The last mark, “A/TF”, was a mark used 1810-1824 to show that the silver tax levied by the Austrian Empire to offset the costly war with France had been paid. The “A” here shows that the mark was struck at the assay office in Vienna; your ladle must’ve migrated there by that time. So it does agree completely with your family story. Although the Austrian Empire wouldn’t technically come into existence until 1804 (and the Austro-Hungarian Empire until 1867), Hungary and Austria were both possessions of the House of Hapsburg-Lorraine at the time this ladle was made. There’s no doubt it could have come from an old Austrian family. Summing up: Pest (now Budapest), Hungary, 1792-1797, by Jozsef Prandtner, Sr. (working 1791-1819), re-marked Vienna 1810-1824. Congratulations; it's always great when family tradition holds up to the facts! IP: Logged |
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efuerst100 Posts: 34 |
posted 01-18-2009 11:41 AM
I am absolutely awed by and appreciative of your knowledge. I am sure my parents - who are in their eighties - also will be tickled to find out so much about this treasured family heirloom. To initiate my use of the ladle, I clearly need to dust off my grandmother's famous goulosh recipe, which perhaps also came from a more Hungarian tranche of the family tree! Thank you so much! IP: Logged |
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Kimo Posts: 1627 |
posted 01-18-2009 06:42 PM
It is wonderful to have family silver passed down to you. I hope you use it often and pass it down to your kids or grandkids one day. By the way, it is not really correct to call European silver 'coin silver' which is a term used for American silver made until about the 3rd quarter of the 19th century, give or take. Back then, before the big silver discoveries in the American west silver was not so easy for American silversmiths to come by and they often melted down anything they could find such as old broken or worn silverware, out of style silver, and sometimes some coins tossed in as well. As such the silver content was always a bit uncertain but tended to be in the range of about 90% pure - give or take a few percentage points. Continental silver of that era was made in different purities, but it was fairly strictly regulated in those countries to deliberate and exact purities such as the '13 lot' which is 81.3% silver. IP: Logged |
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efuerst100 Posts: 34 |
posted 01-19-2009 12:06 PM
Thanks, Kimmo. IP: Logged |
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