Condition question - SMP Silver Salon Forums

SM Publications

Silver Salon Forums - The premier site for discussing Silver.

SMP | Silver Salon Forums | SSF - Guidelines | SSF - FAQ | Silver Sales

In this Forum we discuss the silver of the United Kingdom, as well as British Colonial silver and Old Sheffield Plate.

Past British - Irish Sterling topics/threads worth a look.

How to Post Photos

Want to be a Moderator?

SMP Silver Salon Forums
tline

British / Irish Sterling
tline3

Condition question

profile | register | preferences | faq | search

SSFFriend: Email This Page to Someone!

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Author	Topic: Condition question
feniangirl Posts: 36 Registered: Mar 2002	posted 10-06-2004 08:22 PM I am very particular about the silver I purchase. It absolutely has to be perfect, as condition has such a tremendous effect on the value. Here's the my dilemma. I recently purchased a Scottish quaich hallmarked for Edinburgh, 1832, by E & Co. I searched in vain for a comparable and could find only one that's even reasonably close. However, it is a provincial piece, same size, different style, a little later date. The quaich I purchased (online - yeah, I know) is beautiful. The inside of the bowl has gold gilt that shows very little wear, the engraving of thistles around the edge of the quaich is crisp and very well done, hallmarks are clear with minimal rubbing; it's a nice solid little piece. Once I received it, I examined it closely, as usual, with my loupe. Everything was right and the condition appeared perfect - until examining the hallmarks, I noticed what appears to be a perpendicular repair to the foot. It is what I would consider a hairline and is obviously very old. The major issue is that part of the solder has gone, leaving a tiny hole - about the size of a pin head. I am trying to decide whether or not to return it. I do like it and older quaichs are difficult to find, but I bought it more for an investment - as I am really into Irish silver. The comparable I found was retailing for well over 10 time the price of the nearest comparable. Any dealers or collectors have opinions on this? The English silver ones the same size I have found from the 20th century (20's thru 40's) all seem to sell for much more. Since I don't buy and sell - I just buy, I am kind of curious as to others folks opinions. Should I be able to recoup my investment down the road, if I decide I need the money for an Irish piece? Am I an idiot? Should I keep it or return it? Need to know soon - if I am sending it back. Thanks. IP: Logged
duh unregistered	posted 10-07-2004 10:45 AM caveat emp·tor n. The axiom or principle in commerce that the buyer alone is responsible for assessing the quality of a purchase before buying. IP: Logged
feniangirl Posts: 36 Registered: Mar 2002	posted 10-07-2004 12:32 PM Apparently from the response I did not make myself clear. I am well aware of caveat emptor, DUH! Do you as much about silver as you do about Latin? The question simplified - is does minimal damage or minimal repair render a relatively rare piece of silver valueless? If not, how does one determine the impact on the value? IP: Logged
swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 Registered: May 2003	posted 10-07-2004 02:07 PM As older items become more and more scarce, it becomes necessary to accept less than perfect objects if the interest, provenance, rarity, form, or maker is sufficiently desired by the collector. Is it one-of-a-kind? How easily could a better one be found? Collectinmg and investing can be entirely separate issues. A true collector is often driven by other motivations; in my value system, only if the object is stratospheric in cost does the investment value figure in if it is not an ordinary or run-of-the mill item -- if you got the bargain that it sounds as if you did on an uncommon item you seem to like, there is nothing lost -- keep it and enjoy. Let a good silversmith redo the original repair if it bothers you, but if you need a magnifying glass to see it, well . . . . On the other hand, if you are the kind of person that is so obsessed by perfection or guilt at being "had" that it will bug you every time you look at it, and you cannot appreciate it for what it is, then by all means, send it back, and let someone else enjoy it. IP: Logged
dragonflywink Posts: 993 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 10-07-2004 08:31 PM Started to reply to this post earlier but ended up with a way-too-long dissertation on collecting for the love of it as opposed to the investment value. Glad I didn't post it, because swarter has expressed the same thoughts in a very clear manner. Most collectors will eventually refine their collections and sell off the culls. If you bought this piece as an investment, then obviously you intend to sell at some point. The value of antiques can be a bit esoteric. To you this piece has little value due it's lack of perfection, to another collector, it's beauty and history might make it desirable despite its imperfection. I've been a collector of all types of things for most of my life and a dealer for several years. Some of my silver pieces are quite valuable, others have little monetary value, have some rare pieces in perfect condition and some with flaws, but all give me pleasure. I've sold perfect examples of fairly rare pieces and never regretted it, because they didn't "speak" to me, yet some of my imperfect pieces are among my very favorites. If this piece is going to irk you every time you look at it, by all means return it. Someone else will love it. Cheryl IP: Logged
feniangirl Posts: 36 Registered: Mar 2002	posted 10-07-2004 09:20 PM Thanks, guys. I appreciate your responses. The piece doesn't upset me at all, in fact I'm quite fond of it because of it's apparent quality and craftsmanship. It definitely appears to be a one off, as well. By the way, as far as my investing as opposed to collecting - it may just be a psycholgical issue - as I have yet to bring myself to even try to sell one piece of silver. IP: Logged
dragonflywink Posts: 993 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 10-08-2004 11:11 AM Hi feniangirl, Ooh, now you're sunk, you've grown fond of it! Sounds like a keeper. If you're able to post photos, I'm sure that there are several of us that would love to see the quaich. Cheryl IP: Logged
Dale Posts: 2132 Registered: Nov 2002	posted 10-08-2004 12:35 PM Let's see here. We want to have an old item, one with a history. We want it to be both very old, well made, and like new. This is not reality. Old things have invariably been used. Some have wear. Some have damage. Some even have repairs. Life is like that. As we age, we wear out. IP: Logged
Waylander Posts: 131 Registered: Sep 2004	posted 10-08-2004 07:12 PM There is a great pleasure to be had from not only owning and enjoying a well used piece of silver, but also in knowing that the previous owners enjoyed and loved the piece just as much as you do. The ability of silver to bring pleasure is an ability that transcends ages. Waylander IP: Logged
agleopar Posts: 850 Registered: Jun 2004	posted 10-08-2004 08:10 PM One aspect of the repair-no repair question is that an old, good repair is a respected part of the history of the piece. A bad repair, old or new is always disapointing and some times makes the repair of the repair a more involved job than if it had never been repaired to begin with. Iam repairing back to my hole, hope this adds... IP: Logged
t-man-nc Posts: 327 Registered: Mar 2000	posted 10-20-2004 09:14 AM I always love witnessing the birth of a new silverphile.... "Smaug" Welcome to our world Feniangirl...! IP: Logged

All times are ET	next newest topic \| next oldest topic
Administrative Options: Close Topic \| Archive/Move \| Delete Topic
	Hop to:

Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.46a

^1. Public Silver Forums (open Free membership) - anyone with a valid e-mail address may register. Once you have received your Silver Salon Forum password, and then if you abide by the Silver Salon Forum Guidelines, you may start a thread or post a reply in the New Members' Forum. New Members who show a continued willingness to participate, to completely read and abide by the Guidelines will be allowed to post to the Member Public Forums.
Click here to Register for a Free password

^2. Private Silver Salon Forums (invitational or $ donation membership) - The Private Silver Salon Forums require registration and special authorization to view, search, start a thread or to post a reply. Special authorization can be obtained in one of several ways: by Invitation; Annual $ Donation; or via Special Limited Membership. For more details click here (under development).

^3. Administrative/Special Private Forums (special membership required) - These forums are reserved for special subjects or administrative discussion. These forums are not open to the public and require special authorization to view or post.

| Home | Order | The Guide to Evaluating Gold & Silver Objects | The Book of Silver