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Maker's mark RG over FB

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Author	Topic: Maker's mark RG over FB
joel33477 Posts: 5 Registered: Apr 2005	posted 04-11-2005 07:32 AM [26-0352] Hello, I'm a newbie and need help in identifying a maker's mark that sits in a square. The letters are RG over ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, FB At the bottom of the square the line slopes upward and touches the B and hides its bottom so that it could be an R. Pictures included. I can interpret the other marks. Any help with the maker's mark will be much appreciated. Thanks IP: Logged
swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 Registered: May 2003	posted 04-11-2005 12:30 PM Richard Groves and Francis Barker were smallworkers who registered this mark in 1861, which is consistent with your date mark of 1864. IP: Logged
joel33477 Posts: 5 Registered: Apr 2005	posted 04-11-2005 12:33 PM Thank you much for your assistance. Can you tell me if they were in partnership and what that name would be? Do you have an adress? Is it common for two smiths to work on one article? If these questions are inappropriate I appologize. Thanks again, IP: Logged
swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 Registered: May 2003	posted 04-11-2005 01:39 PM They were in business as Groves & Barker from 1848 - 1865 at "16 Market Street, St. John's Street Road, Clerkenwell, where they were listed as mariner's compass and sundial makers." The firm was continued by Barker and his sons until about 1960. they operated a "manufactory," and so probably employed a number of journeymen, apprentices, and other factory workers, any of whom could have worked on any of the items, under the nominal supervision of one or both of the partners. The mark does not guarantee that either of them ever worked on the piece. Your watch case may have been one lf the last item to have been produced by the partnertship. Francis Barker is listed as having entered his own mark as a smallworker in 1867; there may have been an earlier one, or he may have continued to use the old mark in the interim. IP: Logged
joel33477 Posts: 5 Registered: Apr 2005	posted 04-11-2005 04:33 PM Outstanding, I can't tell you how much I appreciate the information. The watch case is in fact a small compass that was presented to a young English naval Officer in 1865 by the Lords of the Admiralty. I have quite a bit of paper documentation, but what was missing was the maker of the award. Here's the front side of the case showing a jeweled compass card. Best, Joel IP: Logged
swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 Registered: May 2003	posted 04-11-2005 06:56 PM Very nice. Thanks for adding the image of the face. Copuld you transcribe the inscription for us? It is not quite legible in the photograph. IP: Logged
joel33477 Posts: 5 Registered: Apr 2005	posted 04-11-2005 07:19 PM Gladly, ADMIRALTY Hall Marks HMS Britannia June, 1865 Adolophus Carcaud For French This was awarded when he was still a midshipman. In later papers certifying to his professional competancy, French was one of the skills that were graded along with the Naval subjects. I recall that up until the end of WW II, French was considered the postal language of the world and was likely most important in the 1850's. Joel IP: Logged
swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 Registered: May 2003	posted 04-11-2005 07:56 PM Thank you. I believe there is "Presentation" following "Admiralty"? If I judge the sound of his name correctly, French was probably second nature to him! [This message has been edited by swarter (edited 04-11-2005).] IP: Logged
joel33477 Posts: 5 Registered: Apr 2005	posted 04-12-2005 07:41 AM You are correct on both counts. However, it is unlikey that he was the only midshipman serving on the Britannia with a French heritage. Thanks for pointing out my omission re: Presentation. Joel IP: Logged

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