posted 02-22-2009 10:38 AM            

Direct delivered from auction purchase. Original England, bought in USA and now returned to Europe - to me.

The story might be know to most of the forum members. But here it is anyhow.

Seller said: Handle made of horn or wood, facsimile 1758 British coin, no hallmarks but tested for silver. Unusual and early silver item.

So most of the description was correct. However the coin is original in fact both coins are. (2 coins - more to follow)

Horn or wood.

It is neither because it is from a whale. In the whales mouth we have barder. And that is what the handle is made of. The ladle is for hot punch so we need a handle that does not transport the heat. Normally a wooden handle is used and at the end of the wood is a ball made of ivory. But not in this case. The bard - on structure it is a line of threads. So if you drill into the end to fasten a ivory ball - you destroy it. Therefor the silver end. As expected. The whales bard can be compared to our nails. It is the same sort of material. When the bard is boiled it becomes soft and can be formed. When twisted and fixed - when it becomes cold it keep the shape.

The 2 coins. The one in center 1758 dates the piece.

An English shilling. It cannot be older. Among 1760 + 30 years. See the kartusch it is pure rococo.

That's where we are in time.

The second coin - that is the rest of the bowl. It is made out of a second coin. And therefore it has no hallmarks - it is not supposed to have hallmarks.

You take a large silver coin. You heat it and then you start hammering. From the center in cirkels out towards the coin edge. You must never hit the edge.

But you get close to the edge. See how the edge of the bowl is grooved. Bear in mind that the bowl has a larger diameter than the coin - therefore "the space between each ..-

When heating and hammering the silver becomes very thin and the edge get weekend. Therefore never hit the edge.

As it is a coin - no hallmarks is expected. Is it also a British shilling or is it a half crown - or a crown?? don't know, anyone have an opinion? We do not know which silver smith that made this. But we know that it is a time consuming process. Therefore they stopped manufacture. The cost of silver was (approx) 80% of the items price. Add the handle, and the craftsmanship, sales and promotion - in total 20%. That's why they stopped with these time consuming processes. Sheffield plate was introduced and machine was invented.

Now we have the bowl, and the handle. It is now time to make the ornamentation. Think how time consuming that process was. Every little thing is made by hand with a hammer. And still the 20% should cover all that time too. And see how good he was - oh it is nice. I don't know how long the hammering process took - but we talk days.

Today nice but useless.

I have a Swedish friend and he has one similar. He told me the story of his. And I have been searching for one.

And there on line my first buy. Sellers description dated and told us that it was silver. So that was OK. He just did not know this little story regarding the manufacture. I suppose that everybody here knows about use of coins. But I have now given an example.

Interesting and nice - I think.

Please comment and correct me. I would like to know more. I have been told that these are common in England - In Denmark they are not.

posted 02-22-2009 11:09 AM            

I am talking about right side of picture, at the left side you see the edge of the shilling in the middle - that one is not touched.

posted 02-22-2009 01:17 PM            

It was the retention of this detail which made it clear that a coin had been used, thus guaranteeing the fineness of the silver and avoiding the need for hallmarking.

posted 03-24-2009 04:43 PM            

Mine does not have the text at edge. It is grooved (I think the word is)

posted 07-14-2009 06:07 PM            

Never the less I have just been to Guernsy and bought this one - 10 cm long, London 1805. Not made of a coin, but a small one.

Might start a collection.

posted 07-15-2009 02:54 AM            

The size was a little underestimated. the handle is 10cm. From bottom of bowl to tip of silver at other end it is 15 cm.

The end with the silver top is not made that nice - it could have been changed.

The finish where handle meets bowl is much nicer.
I have not seen this difference when I bought it. But that could be the case.

posted 07-15-2009 11:17 AM            

I associate toddy ladles with Scotland - different drinking habits north of the border. Perhaps yours was made for one of the many Scots who moved south. Most Scottish toddy ladles that I see are all silver like the other example in my picture though this one comes from Newcastle, the English assay office nearest to the Scottish border. They are similar to sauce ladles but with relatively longer and more upright handles. There seem to be far fewer with whalebone handles. I don't know whether that means fewer were made or just that fewer have survived because they are more easily damaged.

What I think of as punch ladles are often also described as toddy ladles but I prefer to reserve the term for these smaller ladles to avoid confusion.

posted 07-15-2009 03:46 PM            

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Incidentally, I wonder whether this thread ought to be moved to the British forum?

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